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This page chronicles my conversation with a spammer from China who I decided to
try and contact after I had been receiving up to 10 messages per day, all from
the same email address.
To protect the guilty, I've removed personal details including email addresses, and have not posted the original mail that I receive/
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Me: |
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你好， 我中文的不好 -
你会说英语吗
我不了解这 |
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My notes: This was my first reply to the spam message. I had no idea if
the recipient spoke English, I didn't even know if they would reply, so
since the original email was in Chinese I started by replying in Chinese.
This message translates to: Hi, my Chinese isn't good - do you speak
English? I do not understand this... (with reference to the spam) |
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Spammer: |
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This is a Ad email.
If you don't want to receive this email, you can add me to black list. |
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My notes: Well, fair
enough - but what if he/she changes address?... |
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Me: |
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I have a better idea - why don't you stop
sending me 'ad mail'. I call it 'spam' and nobody likes spam. By using
spam you don't give a good impression of yourself.
I will add [address removed] to my blacklist, but how do I know you
won't change addresses? |
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My notes: |
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Spammer: |
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I will not change the sender's email address.
But if you receive my email again that the sender is [removed] or
[removed]. It means I searched your email again throught internet.
:) |
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My notes: At this point I realized
this person was surprisingly polite and honest about what they are doing,
so decided to see if I could talk to them some more... |
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Me: |
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Well while I don't agree with your methods of marketing, at least you're honest about it, which I appreciate. Sending 'ad mail' might get customers in the short term, but it won't last long. It's just my opinion, you don't have to take it, but there are better ways of advertising that won't annoy people; I control about 10 email addresses on my domain they all redirect to this one, your mail has been going to every one of those addresses and I've had 10 copies of your email every day. I hope you can understand why I don't like 'ad mail'.
Zaijian,
Matt :) |
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My notes: Zaijian means
goodbye (you could probably guess that though). |
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Spammer: |
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Everyday I received thousands of spam email. I won't reply them and I will read their title to find what's hot in email marketing. In fact, I find my customers by spam email. Everyday I will received 20-30 return email, they are willing to know detail of my service and products. On the meantime, I will received 10-20 return email, they let my stop sending them spam email.
I think in China, email marketing is a effective tools. |
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My notes: Unfortunately,
it isn't just in China that people think spam is an effective marketing
tool. And, unfortunately - it is. Sorry to tell the truth to everyone, but
think about it: why would spammers go to the trouble of sending all those
penis enlargement messages out while taking big risks of detection and
going to a lot of trouble to hide themselves, if a decent number of people
somewhere weren't buying these things?
Perhaps the general public need to be educated as much
as the spammers (actually, the spammers are educated, most of them know
exactly what they are doing and how to get away with it) |
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Me: |
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I don't know what it's like in China, I don't live in China. However, I can tell you that it's true, people do reply to spam email (even I did - but for different reasons). It's a difficult issue that is always debated, if anyone can send anyone else an email why is it wrong to send them advertising? The fact is that it's the same as telemarketing and junk mail (non-email kind) - do you like getting junk mail? Do you like it when salespeople phone you in your home and try to sell you something you don't want? I doubt that you do. It is also illegal to send spam in Europe and the US now (I live in Europe) - but as I said, I don't know what the laws are in China.
I guess I'm not going to convince you, but I ask you to consider that spam gives your company a very bad reputation. It's also giving your country a bad reputation, there are a lot of people who just block all of China's network space to stop spam - of course this is unfair (actually more spam comes from
America), but you sending spam doesn't do yourself or your country any good.
(For the record I have nothing against your country - I just don't like spam)
This has been an interesting conversation, would you mind if I published parts of this email on my website? I will remove your name, email address and the advert you sent originally, so nobody will know it was you. My personal website is: http://www.insidereality.net |
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My notes: I was bluffing a
little here - I don't actually know the details of the anti-spam laws in
America and Europe, in my limited understanding I believe that in Europe
people must opt-in to receive commercial email from Europe based
companies, and something similar exists in the US. Of course, neither can
affect China. However, considering the effort that the Chinese government
put into controlling internet access, I'm always surprised at how they
just turn a blind eye to spam, a big problem in China (although last I
checked, America was the top spammer, with Korea in second place and then
China in third). |
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Spammer: |
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I will not mind you publish parts of this email on your website.
In China, We don't think sending spam email is illegal. Everyday I received more about 2000-3000 emails from 10 email account. 99% of them are spam emails. But, maybe, In Europe, It is illegal. In fact, I collect email address only from Simplified Chinese websites. Sometimes, the software will crawl to Europe or American or Japan websites through links. I can not control that My destination customers are all from mainland of China.
And I also don't hate telemarketing. Sales will not phone in my home because they don't know the number. In my office, I will be phoned by sales who I don't recognize several times a day.
Everytime I have patient to listen to them, then I tell them I don't like their products or I want to know detail of their products. I understand it is their job. I will not let my refusing to hurt their hearts. One team in my company use telemarketing to find customers. Everyday 100 outbound call per people. |
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My notes: So I guess I've
brought this upon myself, because if I have Chinese on any of my web pages
I must be from mainland China and interested in his products. He's right though, I do have Chinese characters on some of my pages, but I'm not even Chinese.
It also seems at this point that this isn't some
small operation by a lone spammer. I would guess the spammer is a member
of a medium to large sized marketing company. |
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Me: |
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Thanks for letting me publish this.
My websites do have pages with Simplified Chinese on them, so that is why
you found my address. Don't you really hate getting 2000-3000 spams per day?
Maybe you do, but have you asked other people if they like getting spam?
I'll be surprised if you find me one person who really does.
By the way: could you tell me the Chinese for spam?
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My notes: I really didn't
know the Chinese for spam. |
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Spammer: |
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The Truth is I can sign 3 or 4 contract per week, and the customers are all from spam email.
If the spam email is no use for me, I will not waste time on it.
In Chinese,the spam is called 垃圾邮件. |
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My notes: Well we've
already established that spam can make money, the problem I have with it
is the morality of that method of making money. Also, the Chinese for spam:
'垃圾邮件' translates back to English literally as 'junk
mail' (I really should have tried guessing...). So I think the idea that
the Chinese "don't mind spam" is firmly disproved by that... |
(Note: I'm posting this as I believe it provides an interesting insight into
spamming, I have removed any information which could identify this email with my
contact in China. In doing so, I am not trying to protect this spammer.
Considering the way I have conducted this email, I feel it would be dishonest to
out right lie after telling this person I would keep their details private;
regardless of who they are I intend to uphold that)
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